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JAugustW
Junior Boarder
Posts:81

Bill Graham, UGLY-ass threads, and some last words

#99298 2 years, 7 months ago
Almost don't know where to start...
First, I guess, I'd like to say thanks to the people who sent me messages and also to those who spoke up on my behalf.
And next, I want to explain this: I have little patience and less tolerance for those who make disparaging remarks about Furthur, The Dead, their respective managements, and the various people behind the scenes who have helped keep this music out here for us.
Are all those people perfect? And beyond criticism? Well, of course not. No one is. But this music is so special to me -- it really turned my life around... saved it, really -- I genuinely have trouble processing things when others start carping about set lists, venues or ticket prices. And when they get called "greedy motherfuckers?" Well, so to speak, for me, "them's fightin' words."
I'm not crazy about it, either, when I get called a "bailer" because I don't go to shows anymore, and then have someone even question if I am who I say I am: i.e. a Deadhead of over four decades standing. Christ! Does someone really believe I made the shit up that I posted on here the past few days? If so... Wow! That's some serious distrust and/or paranoia.
As some of my contemporaries used to say some decades back, yesterday was a real downer. At least the Bill Graham thread was.
People got called motherfucker, punk wannabes, assholes and giant douches among other things.
Sorry, but I don't think individuals who are so quick to stoop to that sort of thing, are being... touched... by this music at all. Even if they "kiss and make up" afterwards. But that's just my lyin' phony ass opinion.
But back to Bill Graham. If he had any reaction to anything at all yesterday, it would likely have been "What the fuck's wrong with those people?"
Well, who the fuck knows? But it goes a long way towards explaining why this site quickly lost its charm for me, and also why I opt to live in the middle of nowhere.
Maybe I'm coming across now as overly sensitive and judgmental, but that's really not what's driving these words. Nor am I trying to play wise, old elder Deadhead. But it's screamingly obvious that at least some members of this community aren't really getting this music at all. Which is truly fucking sad... on more than one level.
In closing, although I posted this after saying yesterday I was giving up the site, I really am going to do that. Just wanted to say a few things before I did.
I'll still read it, and likely correspond with some members who seem not to be wound too tight, but that's it. As the old cliche goes, I'm too old for the shit that went down yesterday.
So, as they say in these parts, Happy Holidays, y'all. Be well! And never stop listenin' to the music play.
The following user(s) said Thank You: 83msg1sttyme, Chester, PMoondancer , kevin, lightchaser, SunshineSue, teafortexas, Strider1
splatter_face
Platinum Boarder
Posts:2174

Re: Bill Graham, UGLY-ass threads, and some last words

#99299 2 years, 7 months ago
August -

I am certain that if you met any of the people that were involved in yesterdays thread (me included) in person it would not seem so intense. Stick around man. My dad has been in the scene as long as you, and has told me stories of free shows in GG park, acid tests etc. He has the same issue with shows that you have and also has a Jerry complex that prevents him from attending shows. You older dudes are needed in this community!!

Josh
.....nine mile skid on a ten mile ride
gr8fuljen
Expert Boarder
Posts:616

Re: Bill Graham, UGLY-ass threads, and some last words

#99300 2 years, 7 months ago
Quote: I want to explain this: I have little patience and less tolerance for those who make disparaging remarks about Furthur, The Dead, their respective managements, and the various people behind the scenes who have helped keep this music out here for us.
Are all those people perfect? And beyond criticism? Well, of course not. No one is. But this music is so special to me -- it really turned my life around... saved it, really -- I genuinely have trouble processing things when others start carping about set lists, venues or ticket prices. And when they get called "greedy motherfuckers?" Well, so to speak, for me, "them's fightin' words."


Dude, really? if you have trouble processing this, and hearing those remarks about a band mind you.. not your family, not anyone close to you in real life then you may not want to be on the internet.
I also did not say you made anything up, I basically said you can't blindly trust anyone who just pops in and says X, Y and Z.
and then have a group of people here jump on one person insisting that he "respect his elders" because someone older than him doesn't agree with his opinion.
This isn't the 70's man.. its almost 2012.. things are different and not everyone tells the truth and there are plenty of creepy people on the internet..you came here and started posting your deadsume basically.. and hey, if that makes you happy then thats fine.
If being called a bailer is really that hurtful to you then you may want to seek some counseling of some sort.. seriously.. there is no need to act like someone has outrageously insulted your mother or something.
We are all entitled to our opinions man.. and if one or some of us feel the band or their managment are "greedy motherfuckers" then that's their opinion. I dont know how long you've been on the internet but when you chime in on a thread that someone else created then you need to be prepared to read some good and some not so good stuff. Don't take it so personally.. you'll give your self a heart attack..
I hope you have a peaceful day...
The following user(s) said Thank You: furthur1
scar1et_f1re
Platinum Boarder
Posts:4900
R U Kind?

Re: Bill Graham, UGLY-ass threads, and some last words

#99301 2 years, 7 months ago
Happy and healthy holidays to you too - and to everyone on this site. On many levels we love each other - and thus we fight. As I get older I see in real life we sometimes hurt the ones we love the most Stupid stuff was said ( my opinion) and it's happened here before and it will unfortunately happen again. Almost reminds me of a show. It used to drive me crazy watching people do thoughtless stuff like tossing bottles all over ( don't you see all the barefoot people). I love the scene but not all deadheads live their lives ... Well Jerry / Dylan said it best in " forever young". Righteous, caring. Same here lots of people so life happens.

Without beating it to death most of the people mixing it up have been super kind here in the past. Online and in real life. It felt like yesterday was the exception rather than the rule

I'm happy to hear you'll stick around here on some level. If 'we' chase people off here shame on us. But we will fight as brothers and sisters who care for each other and the music have and always will do.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts. Maybe it will help us remember that our behavior can hurt people - not just the people we are mixing it up with.

Peace to everyone. And again - please stay in touch on some level? There are some of the kindest freakin people here. And as you saw lots of us got upset at the actions of a few. And we do stand up for our owncause we believe it's the proper / human thing to do.

WALSTIB
FFF! Family is Forever!!!

May God bless and keep you always
May your wishes all come true
May you always do for others
And let others do for you
The following user(s) said Thank You: PMoondancer , mcolleen
captaintony
Platinum Boarder
Posts:3691

Re: Bill Graham, UGLY-ass threads, and some last words

#99314 2 years, 7 months ago
Hey I'm offended by the creepy comment, cause I'm as creepy as they come and I don't want to be lumped in with some amateur creepiness.
The following user(s) said Thank You: PMoondancer
kevin
Platinum Boarder
Posts:3251

Re: Bill Graham, UGLY-ass threads, and some last words

#99316 2 years, 7 months ago
gr8fuljen wrote:
Quote: I want to explain this: I have little patience and less tolerance for those who make disparaging remarks about Furthur, The Dead, their respective managements, and the various people behind the scenes who have helped keep this music out here for us.
Are all those people perfect? And beyond criticism? Well, of course not. No one is. But this music is so special to me -- it really turned my life around... saved it, really -- I genuinely have trouble processing things when others start carping about set lists, venues or ticket prices. And when they get called "greedy motherfuckers?" Well, so to speak, for me, "them's fightin' words."


Dude, really? if you have trouble processing this, and hearing those remarks about a band mind you.. not your family, not anyone close to you in real life then you may not want to be on the internet.
I also did not say you made anything up, I basically said you can't blindly trust anyone who just pops in and says X, Y and Z.
and then have a group of people here jump on one person insisting that he "respect his elders" because someone older than him doesn't agree with his opinion.
This isn't the 70's man.. its almost 2012.. things are different and not everyone tells the truth and there are plenty of creepy people on the internet..you came here and started posting your deadsume basically.. and hey, if that makes you happy then thats fine.
If being called a bailer is really that hurtful to you then you may want to seek some counseling of some sort.. seriously.. there is no need to act like someone has outrageously insulted your mother or something.
We are all entitled to our opinions man.. and if one or some of us feel the band or their managment are "greedy motherfuckers" then that's their opinion. I dont know how long you've been on the internet but when you chime in on a thread that someone else created then you need to be prepared to read some good and some not so good stuff. Don't take it so personally.. you'll give your self a heart attack..
I hope you have a peaceful day...


so......it's ok to post whatever you want because "it''s the internet", i think the gentleman's point is more or less, "if you wouldn't say it to someones face, don't post it", , justifying why it is ok to rail against someone is wrong, if this conversation were in a lot at a show, i don't see the same hatefulness occuring, and 1 more thing....... how did the grateful dead go 30 years without the internet fan base ???, go figure
-- smell every flower --
The following user(s) said Thank You: 83msg1sttyme
teafortexas
Expert Boarder
Posts:755
Dancin on a pin

Re: Bill Graham, UGLY-ass threads, and some last words

#99318 2 years, 7 months ago
JAugustW wrote:
Almost don't know where to start...
First, I guess, I'd like to say thanks to the people who sent me messages and also to those who spoke up on my behalf.
And next, I want to explain this: I have little patience and less tolerance for those who make disparaging remarks about Furthur, The Dead, their respective managements, and the various people behind the scenes who have helped keep this music out here for us.
Are all those people perfect? And beyond criticism? Well, of course not. No one is. But this music is so special to me -- it really turned my life around... saved it, really -- I genuinely have trouble processing things when others start carping about set lists, venues or ticket prices. And when they get called "greedy motherfuckers?" Well, so to speak, for me, "them's fightin' words."
I'm not crazy about it, either, when I get called a "bailer" because I don't go to shows anymore, and then have someone even question if I am who I say I am: i.e. a Deadhead of over four decades standing. Christ! Does someone really believe I made the shit up that I posted on here the past few days? If so... Wow! That's some serious distrust and/or paranoia.
As some of my contemporaries used to say some decades back, yesterday was a real downer. At least the Bill Graham thread was.
People got called motherfucker, punk wannabes, assholes and giant douches among other things.
Sorry, but I don't think individuals who are so quick to stoop to that sort of thing, are being... touched... by this music at all. Even if they "kiss and make up" afterwards. But that's just my lyin' phony ass opinion.
But back to Bill Graham. If he had any reaction to anything at all yesterday, it would likely have been "What the fuck's wrong with those people?"
Well, who the fuck knows? But it goes a long way towards explaining why this site quickly lost its charm for me, and also why I opt to live in the middle of nowhere.
Maybe I'm coming across now as overly sensitive and judgmental, but that's really not what's driving these words. Nor am I trying to play wise, old elder Deadhead. But it's screamingly obvious that at least some members of this community aren't really getting this music at all. Which is truly fucking sad... on more than one level.
In closing, although I posted this after saying yesterday I was giving up the site, I really am going to do that. Just wanted to say a few things before I did.
I'll still read it, and likely correspond with some members who seem not to be wound too tight, but that's it. As the old cliche goes, I'm too old for the shit that went down yesterday.
So, as they say in these parts, Happy Holidays, y'all. Be well! And never stop listenin' to the music play.


I am so glad that you took the time to share your thoughts regarding the debacle that went down yesterday. I am sure that none of us are so naive to think that we should all agree on passionate subjects. Viewpoints aside, we should agree as a supportive, open, and fun community that there is NO place for the kind of personal attacks that we witnessed yesterday.
The spirit of the music (business aside) and the beautiful tapestry that is created by masters of their craft binds us all together. There are thousands of other ‘communities’ we could choose to be a part of. The reasons that each of us are here are our own. Some are here to connect with other people who share our viewpoints, our passions, our life experiences, our hopes, and mostly our love for this music. I got the feeling that some others are here for some of these reasons but also seek to incite negativity, distrust, and condescension. Frankly, I do not have the time, the energy, or the inclination to be part of something that seeks to sabotage what I covet. I am saddened by the prospect of missing the opportunity to connect with some wonderful people all because a select few choose make disparaging comments about people they don’t even know. Here’s an idea: Look in the mirror and ask yourself if you are making this community better or worse. If you are here to incite negativity, distrust, and hate, there are some other places where you will fit right in – you are not welcome here.
If not saying my shit doesn’t stink from time to time. We all have our weak, selfish, and destructive moments and I have made some mistakes in my life that would more than raise some eyebrows I can tell you that. My bottom line is this > Let’s try harder not to fuck this whole thing up. I need this place and don’t want to have to give it up because it takes more from me more than it gives.
JAugustW > send me a private message if you are so inclined. I would love to talk more about the things you have experienced, your life on the farm, and to share some music – I have been blessed with more shows (GD & JGB) than I could listen to for the next 30 years and maybe there is something special in there for you.
Peace,
Ed
Everybody is either making love...Or else expecting rain
The following user(s) said Thank You: 83msg1sttyme, PMoondancer
Equinox
Platinum Boarder
Posts:16509

Re: Bill Graham, UGLY-ass threads, and some last words

#99322 2 years, 7 months ago
This is normally a pretty mellow place. I said it before and I'll say it again, I think most of the current tension is the result of the frustration over the short spring tour and/or the difficulty in obtaining Beacon tickets.
"Got any nails?"
"No!"
"Got any flies?"
nycdave
Platinum Boarder
Posts:5231

Re: Bill Graham, UGLY-ass threads, and some last words

#99326 2 years, 7 months ago
Time for a quote from Phil, circa 2006:
"Don't worry up your mind
People are sick and mean sometimes
They're only words
They're only words."
He goes on:
"In the end, what we want or enjoy in life comes down to personal preference; the best and the bravest will always follow their own path in their listening, in their reading, in their thinking, without any conern for the opinions of others.
Words of comfort whispered to the injured,
words of courage whispered to the scared,
words of encouragememt whispered to a child,
words of love whispered to the sky.

Words have a great power; use them wisely."
The following user(s) said Thank You: PMoondancer
gr8fuljen
Expert Boarder
Posts:616

Re: Bill Graham, UGLY-ass threads, and some last words

#99329 2 years, 7 months ago
kevin wrote:
gr8fuljen wrote:
Quote: I want to explain this: I have little patience and less tolerance for those who make disparaging remarks about Furthur, The Dead, their respective managements, and the various people behind the scenes who have helped keep this music out here for us.
Are all those people perfect? And beyond criticism? Well, of course not. No one is. But this music is so special to me -- it really turned my life around... saved it, really -- I genuinely have trouble processing things when others start carping about set lists, venues or ticket prices. And when they get called "greedy motherfuckers?" Well, so to speak, for me, "them's fightin' words."


Dude, really? if you have trouble processing this, and hearing those remarks about a band mind you.. not your family, not anyone close to you in real life then you may not want to be on the internet.
I also did not say you made anything up, I basically said you can't blindly trust anyone who just pops in and says X, Y and Z.
and then have a group of people here jump on one person insisting that he "respect his elders" because someone older than him doesn't agree with his opinion.
This isn't the 70's man.. its almost 2012.. things are different and not everyone tells the truth and there are plenty of creepy people on the internet..you came here and started posting your deadsume basically.. and hey, if that makes you happy then thats fine.
If being called a bailer is really that hurtful to you then you may want to seek some counseling of some sort.. seriously.. there is no need to act like someone has outrageously insulted your mother or something.
We are all entitled to our opinions man.. and if one or some of us feel the band or their managment are "greedy motherfuckers" then that's their opinion. I dont know how long you've been on the internet but when you chime in on a thread that someone else created then you need to be prepared to read some good and some not so good stuff. Don't take it so personally.. you'll give your self a heart attack..
I hope you have a peaceful day...


so......it's ok to post whatever you want because "it''s the internet", i think the gentleman's point is more or less, "if you wouldn't say it to someones face, don't post it", , justifying why it is ok to rail against someone is wrong, if this conversation were in a lot at a show, i don't see the same hatefulness occuring, and 1 more thing....... how did the grateful dead go 30 years without the internet fan base ???, go figure


no where did I say it was ok to post anything you want because its the internet...seriously...but it is ok to post your opionion.. others dont have to like it.. and believe me.. anything I post.. I WILL say in person.. that I can promise. you. No one railed against him...if he has problems reading opinions that differ from his.. then perhaps the internet isn't the place where he should spend his time if it upsets him so much.
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