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sweetwilliamisdead
Junior Boarder
Posts:131

Re: POLICE STATE

#248247 1 year, 5 months ago
we could easily make major cuts without cutting things like education, research and important things like that. yes military spending is out of control and it is not being addressed by either side on the hill, our overseas military installments and bases need to be cut extensively and all wars ended immediately. As do places like Guantanamo bay. hell we could have covered the whole cost of the sequester with cutting foreign aid (we dont need to be giving places like israel $3 billion dollars a year to be aggressive zionists anyway). there is plenty of fat that could be easily discarded. cut farming subsidies. we can phase out or rehaul social security before it becomes a major issue. change drug prohibition laws allowing cuts on law enforcement(which 30% of their money goes to drugs as it is) and would take pressure of costs of jails and prisons (we have the most per capita incarcerated in world). There is a whole laundry list of things that could be addressed and turned into savings that dont involve cutting infrastructure, education or scraping all social programs.

If you have like an hour to read something interesting give this a look and let me know what you think brad. im sure you will be more than disagreeing but I would love to hear some thoughts on it, a interesting piece if nothing else.
www.nationalaffairs.com/publications/det...nd-the-welfare-state
Gratefullyjohn
Junior Boarder
Posts:296
Let it ride, let it roll... LET IT ROLL

Re: POLICE STATE

#248252 1 year, 5 months ago
Also remember it isn't the rich or the government paying for all this welfare, and health care. It's the hard working Americans who are being taxed out of their ass. Just throwing that out there
Broken heart don't feel so bad, you ain't got half of what you thought you had
RowTimmy
Senior Boarder
Posts:559

Re: POLICE STATE

#248254 1 year, 5 months ago
Where is Ross Perot when you need him.
lostsailor
Senior Boarder
Posts:552

Re: POLICE STATE

#248261 1 year, 5 months ago
I suggest anyone who complains about our government to go read De Tocqueville's work, Democracy in America. You'll better understand one important fact that the last few generations of Americans do not understand and seem to refuse to accept: We have a participatory form of governnment. It means voting, supporting candidates, bipartisanship. Stop claiming that the banks or rich own government- you own it but you've all decided to pretend otherwise so you can have your MTV and everything else. But people (like those making this vapid conspiratorial arguments here) don't think they have to vote, or go and spend effort to support a candidate that COULD BRING CHANGE. Instead, you'd rather argue on a fan music site about conspiracies. You have the government you wanted. Today, tomorrow and probably for the rest of our lives because you have decided "what's the point?". Idiiocy. Go look in the mirror. 16% of the voters in my city voted for mayor this month. less than 10,000 people participated in my district councilmember's seat for a population of something like a million residents. They can't bother to vote but they surely can protest in a few weeks when the candidate who WAS elected goes about fulfilling his promises. You can't bitch if you can't bother to vote. You can't bitch when you don't even know your legislature, his/her platform, and how they voted (or didn't vote) recently.

So I just gotta laugh (and then cry) at all these people who write thread after thread about Obama this and obama that. What the fuck have you done (participated in) to fix the problem? We've been watching a tsunami coming towards us for the last 20 years. And it's on the shore right now.... and it's all Obama's fault, or that we have no rights, or they have done this or that. but instead of bracing for the storm and coming togetehr to fight it- everyone jsut points fingers. Get a life preserver... it's about to hit. And look in the mirror to see who's fault it is.
The following user(s) said Thank You: scar1et_f1re, B-Rad
lostsailor
Senior Boarder
Posts:552

Re: POLICE STATE

#248262 1 year, 5 months ago
sweetwilliamisdead wrote:

If you have like an hour to read something interesting give this a look and let me know what you think brad. im sure you will be more than disagreeing but I would love to hear some thoughts on it, a interesting piece if nothing else.
www.nationalaffairs.com/publications/det...nd-the-welfare-state


I got to her e and stopped: "All over the developed world, nations are coming to terms with the fact that the social-democratic welfare state is turning out to be untenable."

No they are not. End of article.
Gratefullyjohn
Junior Boarder
Posts:296
Let it ride, let it roll... LET IT ROLL

Re: POLICE STATE

#248263 1 year, 5 months ago
Of course it isn't obamas fault, but it's him and his cronies and the people before him that are responsible. I wrote in Ron Paul for president. And the only thing I can do is in a case like this is use the Internet to spread the truth, the "truth" being not to believe everything you hear on the news, because it is all propaganda. The government has lied to us before and they will continue too that way there is no revolution or uprising, dethroning them from power. They don't care about you or me. So the only thing I can do is try and get people to realize you shouldn't be voting for these paid puppets and to vote for someone who has plans set to fix the debt and to limit the governments interference in everything and to rule the country the way our fore fathers wrote it out in the constitution. This same government keeps us from being allowed to grow a plant that's been here since the beginning of time, so we can keep getting addicted to their pain medicines and alcoholic beverages, while this MEDICINE remains illegal to protect their own special interests. Seriously there is no argument. I wouldn't try and argue either I come on here to socialize amongst like minded individuals who share the same love for the music I do. I don't get it how can someone be okay with people who lie, cheat and steal. They send our troops to places so they can establish puppet governments there as well and use all of their resources (opium, oil etc) did you ever realize these "wars" are citizens of their own native lands defending themselfs and their land from American invaders, not "al Qaeda" or some other bullshit. No idiot is gunna be dumb enough to start a war with the most powerful nation in the world. Come on think about it? We wiped out half of Japan in WWII, I would not mess with America if I was some terrorists.
Broken heart don't feel so bad, you ain't got half of what you thought you had
B-Rad
Gold Boarder
Posts:1123

Re: POLICE STATE

#248266 1 year, 5 months ago
sweetwilliamisdead wrote:
we could easily make major cuts without cutting things like education, research and important things like that. yes military spending is out of control and it is not being addressed by either side on the hill, our overseas military installments and bases need to be cut extensively and all wars ended immediately. As do places like Guantanamo bay. hell we could have covered the whole cost of the sequester with cutting foreign aid (we dont need to be giving places like israel $3 billion dollars a year to be aggressive zionists anyway). there is plenty of fat that could be easily discarded. cut farming subsidies. we can phase out or rehaul social security before it becomes a major issue. change drug prohibition laws allowing cuts on law enforcement(which 30% of their money goes to drugs as it is) and would take pressure of costs of jails and prisons (we have the most per capita incarcerated in world). There is a whole laundry list of things that could be addressed and turned into savings that dont involve cutting infrastructure, education or scraping all social programs.

If you have like an hour to read something interesting give this a look and let me know what you think brad. im sure you will be more than disagreeing but I would love to hear some thoughts on it, a interesting piece if nothing else.
www.nationalaffairs.com/publications/det...nd-the-welfare-state


I will look at your link when I have time but I just wanted to correct two things: foreign aid was $40 billion and the sequester cuts are $1.2 trillion over ten years or $120 billion or three times as much as foreign aid. Social security has a $2 trillion surplus and is solvent for the next 30+ years. Let's let those who would be affected by those changes or the shortfall deal with that in a few decades. The rest of the stuff I concurs with but it doesn't do squat to deal with the deficit.
Last Edit: 1 year, 5 months ago by B-Rad.
B-Rad
Gold Boarder
Posts:1123

Re: POLICE STATE

#248270 1 year, 5 months ago
Gratefullyjohn wrote:
Also remember it isn't the rich or the government paying for all this welfare, and health care. It's the hard working Americans who are being taxed out of their ass. Just throwing that out there



Yes and no. The rich do pay the lion's share of the federal budget because they make most of the money. That's not to say they shouldn't or couldn't pay more...there is over one trillion dollars in tax breaks and deductions that go to people who make over $1 million per year! The real issue is increasing income inequality. It's squeezing the middle class out...but high middle class tax rates aren't the cause of the squeeze. And less democratic control over the economy that comes with less government will just make it worse, not better. Also did anyone find a nation that cut its way out of debt, ever?
Last Edit: 1 year, 5 months ago by B-Rad.
sweetwilliamisdead
Junior Boarder
Posts:131

Re: POLICE STATE

#248271 1 year, 5 months ago
"Social Security is not sustainable over the long term at current benefit and tax rates. Beginning
in 2010 and continuing in 2011, the program paid more in benefits and expenses than it
collected in taxes and other noninterest income, and the 2012 Trustees Report projects this
pattern to continue for the next 75 years. The Trustees estimate that the trust funds will be
exhausted by 2033. At that point, payroll taxes and other income will flow into the fund but will
be sufficient to pay only 75% of program costs. As reported in the 2012 Trustees Report, the
projected shortfall over the next 75 years is 2.67% of taxable payroll."

www.ssa.gov/policy/docs/chartbooks/fast_...012/fast_facts12.pdf
the social security administration doesnt seem to have the same confidence in its own future
B-Rad
Gold Boarder
Posts:1123

Re: POLICE STATE

#248279 1 year, 5 months ago
So I said thirty instead of twenty years. At which point we either raise the cap or just pay out 75% instead of 100% for the next few decades. Not exactly a pressing crisis and not the cause of our massive spending. Medical costs are the real issue and we have lots of examples of countries that provide better care and spend much less then we do.
gr8ful bruin
Senior Boarder
Posts:395
Mr. Charlie

Re: POLICE STATE

#248286 1 year, 5 months ago
It is not hard just phase in a 2.7% tax increase for social security over the next 20 years. The thing to remember is that the right has been actively working to keep the economy from a strong recovery to keep obama from any chance of success.

People like my uncle who is a one man plumbing contractor and the notion that it is no big deal if he has to work until he is 67,68, 69 don't realize how difficult it will be for him to work until 65 let alone longer. Try crawling under houses every day and let me know how it goes. Social security is something to be proud of, Americans decided that people dying of hunger and lack of care is something we are certainly better than.

This ayn rand mad max society being advocated by the right is emphatically anti-humanity and un-american. Oh and the deficit has been going down for the last three years. Oh and if the republicans had helped make Obama care better(considering it was a republican plan) the deficit and minimum level of quality of life in america would be increased
Go to Terrapin, no really go to TERRAPIN
The following user(s) said Thank You: B-Rad
sweetwilliamisdead
Junior Boarder
Posts:131

Re: POLICE STATE

#248288 1 year, 5 months ago
the point is that it is no longer paying for itself and will become a larger issue . Your right medical expenses are the biggest problem, i was trying not to go there right off the bat since that is where one of obamas key pieces of legislation was, but yea its the biggest problem. and yeah the new legislation will cause massive increases in spending over the coming years in a system that was already pretty broken. the american approach to health and medicine is for the most part pretty terrible on both the personal and professional level and needs a major overhaul of both priorities and practices.
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