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wlewis
Platinum Boarder
Posts:6472

Re: Could Someone Please Explain...

#241256 1 year, 6 months ago
Ossumpei wrote:
nycdave wrote:
As previously stated, the music is what brings me to shows. To hear live music played well, with a body of material that I enjoy, plus improvised and open ended stuff going on, keeps me coming back for more. It doesn't always work, but once in a while it works really well. The musicians bring new approaches and a sense of joy to the sound that still to this day works (IMHO) well.
For the most part, the 'scene' is what it is. I've been to a bunch of shows (that east coast location obviously helps) and understand Burt's concern about some of the 'stuff' that go on in the 'scene.' Their is a Pransker saying, stating "never trust a prankster." When talking about that expression, one of the Pranksters (I forget who) said that what was meant by this was that Pranksters were human and subject to human failings. People getting trashed, hurting themselves, trashing the environment, doing everything possible but listening to the music, etc does not serve as a model for what humanity is capable of. I have also seen positive loving compassionate understand and empathetic behavior exhibited at shows. Over the years I have learned to accept the good with the bad. I have no expectations that people who like this music will behave any better or worse then people who gather for other music, sports events or whatever. Once in a while you can get shown a light which reflects well on others, even Furthur fans. This is no excuse poor behavior, however...
This did turn into an interesting thread, so to the person who started it, here's hoping that you and your new cat are getting along, even though you might want to find a cooler name for him! At one point you stated that he is not even aware or could care less what you call him. One never knows!


Look at Phish tour for example, I didn't even go to the local show last year because of the scene.


i'm hardly seeing a difference between the two crowds anymore
who else is gonna bring you, a broken arrow?
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nycdave
Platinum Boarder
Posts:5448

Re: Could Someone Please Explain...

#241259 1 year, 6 months ago
Ossumpei wrote:
nycdave wrote:
As previously stated, the music is what brings me to shows. To hear live music played well, with a body of material that I enjoy, plus improvised and open ended stuff going on, keeps me coming back for more. It doesn't always work, but once in a while it works really well. The musicians bring new approaches and a sense of joy to the sound that still to this day works (IMHO) well.
For the most part, the 'scene' is what it is. I've been to a bunch of shows (that east coast location obviously helps) and understand Burt's concern about some of the 'stuff' that go on in the 'scene.' Their is a Pransker saying, stating "never trust a prankster." When talking about that expression, one of the Pranksters (I forget who) said that what was meant by this was that Pranksters were human and subject to human failings. People getting trashed, hurting themselves, trashing the environment, doing everything possible but listening to the music, etc does not serve as a model for what humanity is capable of. I have also seen positive loving compassionate understand and empathetic behavior exhibited at shows. Over the years I have learned to accept the good with the bad. I have no expectations that people who like this music will behave any better or worse then people who gather for other music, sports events or whatever. Once in a while you can get shown a light which reflects well on others, even Furthur fans. This is no excuse poor behavior, however...
This did turn into an interesting thread, so to the person who started it, here's hoping that you and your new cat are getting along, even though you might want to find a cooler name for him! At one point you stated that he is not even aware or could care less what you call him. One never knows!


Dave has a point about the body of work. We're very familiar with and look for the different ways its played. Furthur is sounding great these days, and the show in and of itself is well worth the price of admission.

I have to disagree with the second part. I do have a higher expectation of people at Dead related shows. I've seen it in the past, and it was very prevalent at RR. I behave differently at shows, I'm more polite and nicer to people than usual. I see most people there are the also, and its what I've come to expect. Its why I continue to go. For that matter, over time its made me nicer in daily life overall. Its what has make us Dead Heads, that unique group of people who behave the way they do.

I also expect to see things I don't really appreciate going on, just like my first show in 1982, all the tours, and currently. I looked past it then and that's become my standard. We all know its not perfect, and the band does too. We all still go, so it can't be that bad. Look at Phish tour for example, I didn't even go to the local show last year because of the scene.

As for the cat, well I claim he doesn't know his name or respond to any name, but I will tell you this...when I'm mad at him for making a mess or something and I call him using his full name including the middle names, Chester China Cat NYCDave Mushroom Man Zenobious Pigpen, he knows he's in trouble.


Cat's are very good at sensing human emotion. They know or sense when we are sick. I know this 'cause one time when I was babysitting a friends cat's, I came over after having a tooth extracted. My friends cats knew something was up. They came closer, and offered extra support, helping to soothe the pain. If they can figure all of that out, processing a name sounds easy.

As for being 'more polite and nicer to people during shows', the hope is that we can (if we so choose) extend this knowlede beyond shows. That we can (in theory) take what we learn (from behavior at shows) and extend this knowledge to our own day to day approach to others, beyond shows even.
In terms of 'have(ing) a higher expectation of people at 'Dead related shows', be careful (about expectations). They are kind of like assumptions. Remember (if you will) what Felix (of Felix and Oscar fame - see Odd Couple) said about assumptions. The point being, if we have 'expectation's' we open up the possibility of dissapointment. On the other hand, if people see 'kinder' behavior', we / they might just apply this knowledge to our / their own lives. One can (at least) hope this will happen. To 'expect' this to happen may just be asking for a bit much. Or so i've been told.
Ossumpei
Platinum Boarder
Posts:2726

Re: Could Someone Please Explain...

#241495 1 year, 6 months ago
I hope my cat senses that he's about to be given away. All he does is gently bite and scratch. Its play to him, but not what I wanted in a feline friend. He won't sit on my lap and purr or really anything else but play fight and attack me.

Being from the city I can see why you don't have any expectations from the lot. The crowds are filled with heads, and anyone else that might be in the area at the time. Including tourists, vagrants, criminals, passers by, etc...the folks that make New York the great place that it is, and the scene it is what it is.

I got used to it on the road where it was a very high percentage of Dead Heads and those learning to be. The kindness, love, friendship, were somehow amplified and special because it was a Dead lot. That's why I kept going back, for the love, I'm all about the love.
Let us all look kindly on our neighbor.
direwolflove222
Senior Boarder
Posts:469
Its an obsession but its pleasing

Re: Could Someone Please Explain...

#241521 1 year, 6 months ago
This scene is a 1000x better than Phish.. There is way less nitrous at Furthur than at Phish... Also, even though it is sometimes hard for me to hold a conversation with a lot of people at the furthur lots, most of the people who go at least recognize how special of a thing the Grateful Dead and the community is... I dont know any other scene that has something so important and special

We truly are blessed
eight-sided whispering hallelujah hat rack
Ossumpei
Platinum Boarder
Posts:2726

Re: Could Someone Please Explain...

#241573 1 year, 6 months ago
I agree with direwolflove222.
Let us all look kindly on our neighbor.
SugarMee
Expert Boarder
Posts:736
hay

Re: Could Someone Please Explain...

#241585 1 year, 6 months ago
The Music It's so special. I also take advantage of local flavor every time I attend a show. It's cool to hang in a hotel room, but it seems a waste (just to me) to stay there and not venture out. This is a vacation!! After being around local culture all day and walking into a venue and the lights go out, that's pure magic!! The music is why I am there, but the area is why the music came there. Both are special and it's amazing to see the music play its' way around that.
The following user(s) said Thank You: direwolflove222
SugarMee
Expert Boarder
Posts:736
hay

Re: Could Someone Please Explain...

#241601 1 year, 6 months ago
wlewis wrote:
Ossumpei wrote:
nycdave wrote:
As previously stated, the music is what brings me to shows. To hear live music played well, with a body of material that I enjoy, plus improvised and open ended stuff going on, keeps me coming back for more. It doesn't always work, but once in a while it works really well. The musicians bring new approaches and a sense of joy to the sound that still to this day works (IMHO) well.
For the most part, the 'scene' is what it is. I've been to a bunch of shows (that east coast location obviously helps) and understand Burt's concern about some of the 'stuff' that go on in the 'scene.' Their is a Pransker saying, stating "never trust a prankster." When talking about that expression, one of the Pranksters (I forget who) said that what was meant by this was that Pranksters were human and subject to human failings. People getting trashed, hurting themselves, trashing the environment, doing everything possible but listening to the music, etc does not serve as a model for what humanity is capable of. I have also seen positive loving compassionate understand and empathetic behavior exhibited at shows. Over the years I have learned to accept the good with the bad. I have no expectations that people who like this music will behave any better or worse then people who gather for other music, sports events or whatever. Once in a while you can get shown a light which reflects well on others, even Furthur fans. This is no excuse poor behavior, however...
This did turn into an interesting thread, so to the person who started it, here's hoping that you and your new cat are getting along, even though you might want to find a cooler name for him! At one point you stated that he is not even aware or could care less what you call him. One never knows!


Look at Phish tour for example, I didn't even go to the local show last year because of the scene.


i'm hardly seeing a difference between the two crowds anymore


Whoa!! That's harsh.
Ossumpei
Platinum Boarder
Posts:2726

Re: Could Someone Please Explain...

#241695 1 year, 6 months ago
Yeah Burt, that's harsh man. There's a big difference.

Just look at the ages of the fans. Phish kids are more that, kids.

With that comes a lot of areas to be different.

What's the average of the Furthur fan? Any guesses.

Older,
Cleaner,
More polite,
stay off your lawn more,
Etc etc...
Let us all look kindly on our neighbor.
Griff
Expert Boarder
Posts:833
Don't you see........

Re: Could Someone Please Explain...

#241713 1 year, 6 months ago
Why? Simple truths for myself that I love to travel (do so for my job and combine biz and shows most of the time), I love to meet new people (left my two bros in our GA seats 3 out 6 six sets to hit the floor and meet new people) and MOST important love the music.

My belief is that music "hits" people differently. Many comments in this thread talk about the affects on them physically, emotionally, mentally and physiologically which IMHO means the music is hitting them. Others, like my wife, like and enjoy music but that is all it is, entertainment.

Music REALLY hits me. Hard. So my bext example from this past weekend came during a song I have been wanting to hear for a long time.........Dear Prudence. I lost my mom just about 2 years ago and the line "So let me see you smile again" made me think of her and literally brought tears to my eyes. And it was a great release. I wondered if the people around me who didnt know me thought I was crazy (well I am, but REALLY crazy.......LOL).

I am so thankful that music does this to me. I feel it is a total blessing. I really want to play music again in a band but just have no time (plus I suck.......LOL).

As for the scene........it is unique and fun..........but does suffer from the always obligatory end result of bringing together a large crowd............adverse selection. Yes, there are people there just to rip you off, just like in any other crowd of 5k or 10k people. Sad story but one that was written a long time ago called human fucking nature.
brokenarrow
Gold Boarder
Posts:1020

Re: Could Someone Please Explain...

#241719 1 year, 6 months ago
Some people just go to say I've been to this many shows....
GOOD LOVE
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