• You are here
  • Forum Header
  • Topics not covered in other forums.
Denver Man
Platinum Boarder
Posts:7591
On the day I was born daddy sat down and cried

Re: Furthur -vs- Phil Lesh & Friends

#213523 1 year, 10 months ago
What about RatDog??

I think about any band I like and I immediately identify with the voice(s) of the band, the vocals. Sure the lead, rhythm, bass guitars and drums and keyboards and tambourines etc, the jams, the hard rocking, the exploration, spacey, psychadelic, all that of course plays into the overall band make up but to ME the voice is how I identify with the band. For me to get that Dead feeling I really like hearing that familiar voice. Jerry where are you?? But the "other" voice of Dead music is Mr Bob Weir. It sounds goofy and everything but I immediately feel comfortable when I hear Bob's voice, even if it a mere shadow of the great voice back in the day, I love hearing it. Ok so with Furthur JK fills the Jerry void for me well almost, kind of but hey I get my other voice - Bobby's. Through the Dead's line ups (I'm talking 2003, 2004, 2009) I learned to accept Warren's voice as filling a void, not really Jerry's but at least a void. So when he plays with PLF, I feel comforted and that I am in the Dead zone. It's fine to explore new avenues especially since we don't have much choice. I enjoy the revolving Phil line ups but I haven't really lost my mind over any of them. Except for when Warren is there. Nothing against Jackie at all I like him alot but hearing him squeak out Estimated Prophet doesn't do it for me. I'm almost thinking Bob's voice is more irreplacable than Jerry's in this grand Dead world.

It's funny because from 1965 - 1995 no one was looking for different interpretations of the Grateful Dead music, I mean hell no such thing even existed, other than JGB or Bobby and the Midnights or something, Kingfish. I still gravitate more towards to the familiar than to the let's explore in some weird way. Sorry that's just what gets me off. That will all change when Bob and Phil hang em up, but I can wait. It's ok to want to hear that original sound, I wish people would at least acknowledge that instead of jumping all over them for not jumping for joy over Stanley Jordan for example. To each their own, that's what we have to remember.

So to answer your question, I would take Furthur ANY day of the week. I like what Terrapin said that Furthur is my wife and PLF my lover. That being said I am very excited for Bob solo. That familiar voice, and I don't care that he botches lyrics or strummed the wrong key, I just love hearing that man sing.
I went walkin' out last summer
Tryin' to find a breath of air
I went walkin' on the mountain
A friend had told me I'd find you there
The following user(s) said Thank You: bxorain, Griff, 66slim, wharfrat71
dougieisirie
Junior Boarder
Posts:131

Re: Furthur -vs- Phil Lesh & Friends

#213528 1 year, 10 months ago
Very good point. I think the difference for me between Furthur and Phil and Friends, is with Furthur you have that same interaction between Bobby's rhythm playing and Jerry as you do with John K. I've been listening to some of the Furthur shows from the last few tours and you can definitely hear that interaction which was so wonderful during the Dead years. Also, I think Bobby's voice has gotten actually better, maybe not quite as strong, but it is more restrained. And I actually think he sings more on key than he did back in the Dead years.

And of course with Furthur you have Sunshine and Jeff who's harmonies are really really great. Way better than when Donna was with the band (Nothing against Donna).

Don't get me wrong I love P&F also. And I love Warren Haynes, I think he is one of the greatest guitarists/singers out there, he just doesn't do it for me singing dead songs.
"Some ask, why play Grateful Dead music??
For those that know, no answer is necessary,
For those that don't, no answer is possible."
The following user(s) said Thank You: Denver Man, wharfrat71
Terrapin Sedation
Platinum Boarder
Posts:2676
Let your life proceed by its own design

Re: Furthur -vs- Phil Lesh & Friends

#213529 1 year, 10 months ago
^^^^

I'm with you Denver Man...If familiarity breeds contempt, it also breeds comfort. It has taken me a long time to adjust to Phil (and others) singing Jerry songs, let alone Bobby songs (e.g. Other One, which he did pretty nice the other night).

Slight correction on your statement that others weren't doing interpretations of GD until post 1995. I think Deadicated brought their music to lots of new audiences. And still has some of my favorite interpretations.


www.allmusic.com/album/deadicated-a-trib...ul-dead-mw0000313528
The following user(s) said Thank You: Denver Man, wharfrat71
nycdave
Platinum Boarder
Posts:5608

Re: Furthur -vs- Phil Lesh & Friends

#213534 1 year, 10 months ago
DenverMan: Furthur is my wife and PLF my lover. That being said I am very excited for Bob solo.
Hey DM, it's okay to have a wife and two luvers, as long as we are talking about music. There is no right or wrong here, people like what they like. I like the approach that Phil took when he first started friends. He chose musicians that would bring their own voice or interpretation to the GD catalogue. People like Warren, Jimi H, Derek Trucks, Steve Kimmock, Trey, Robben Ford, Larry C, and many others. Same deal with the keyboard players, singers, etc. Furthur, both in structure and presentation sounds a lot more like the GD interpretation of the GD. Bob sounds like Bob, John, both in tone and phrasing sounds like, oh I forgot that fellers name. A lot of us thought the party was over in 1995. That this is still going on now is uh, way cool.
Last Edit: 1 year, 10 months ago by nycdave. Reason: spelling issues
The following user(s) said Thank You: Denver Man, Terrapin Sedation, wharfrat71
Griff
Expert Boarder
Posts:844
Don't you see........

Re: Furthur -vs- Phil Lesh & Friends

#213541 1 year, 10 months ago
I'll say again I really enjoy these discussions and hearing everyones's point of view.

It is not a versus as in which band is better or not, or the better musician or anything like that, just a comparison of what each indvidual likes. Reading other people's comments sometimes helps to clarify my own opinions. Or expands my thinking.........ahhhhhhhhhhh the reason for civil discourse.........perhaps you might learn something.

Really, that's what it's all about. The boys explore musically, and since we are not great musicians like them (well I will speak for myself, I kind of sucked but man I tried hard), we get to explore in words and thoughts. Cool!!

DM has a great point on the comfort of voice, and I agree. Many of my fellow tourers also feel that way (the let JK sing crowd).

Yet there are those wildcards.......like Birdsong. I like Phil singing it. It fits my ear so to speak.

I too like to hear songs in standard keys and arrangement, though enjoy the extra stanza that Furthur, especially Bob, adds to many songs between lyrics (see The Other One). It feels comfortable.

Yet...........I also really love the jams they do as intro to songs.

Man, its all just sooooooo good and so much fun. Music........one of the joys of life!!
The following user(s) said Thank You: Denver Man, wharfrat71
Still Takin it Weirder
Platinum Boarder
Posts:1362

Re: Furthur -vs- Phil Lesh & Friends

#213542 1 year, 10 months ago
I really like both. Jackie Greene has been impressing and geting better every yr since I first saw him with Phil in 07?....anyway all I'm gonna say is I'll take any band with Bobby in it over any band without him. That said its like picking ice cream flavors... I prefer Vanilla... it doesn't mean I don't like chocolate. I'dd like to add something else that I just concurred with above. Certain songs that define Bob Weir... like Estimated..Let It Grow.. Sugar Mag..PLF just doesn't seem ..right/authentic to me. Its like if Jerry was alive and Phils band was playing Stella Blue.... something about it just rubs me wrong.
Last Edit: 1 year, 10 months ago by Still Takin it Weirder.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Denver Man, wharfrat71
wharfrat71
Junior Boarder
Posts:72

Re: Furthur -vs- Phil Lesh & Friends

#213552 1 year, 10 months ago
I really liked hearing the Weather Report Prelude the other night without Bobby. I'm sure I've heard Let it Grow without Bob, but not Part 1. Also, Stairway to Heaven was really great the other night. Who was blowing those killer runs? Didn't sound like Jackie or John to me. And, Ratdog is flat out B.A.!!! Period.
ZenoMarx
Gold Boarder
Posts:1024
PLEASE be quiet when the band is playing. PLEASE.

Re: Furthur -vs- Phil Lesh & Friends

#213573 1 year, 10 months ago
90% of the reason I like JK is the familiar tones. Jimmy Herring was about as close as we came before him, and I think Herring is a better player than JK. And make no mistake about it, tonality is HUGELY important to me in music. I key into tones and how they interact and reflect off the other tones. It's why I never really liked Warren Haynes with this music. Had little to do with his playing, because he's a great player. His tones were all off for most GD music (could really make Mason's Children rip, though). I still thought the Q was a great improvisational unit; probably one of the best ever. So yeah, tonality. Throw the right tonality into the mix, and things get beautifully familiar [enough] to take it to that other level I so desperately love to be.
You aren't interesting or clever when you write or speak in the lyrics of others. Rather, what are YOUR words?
The following user(s) said Thank You: Denver Man, wharfrat71
DarrylStingley
Junior Boarder
Posts:86

Re: Furthur -vs- Phil Lesh & Friends

#213576 1 year, 10 months ago
My two cents.

First, both bands are awesome. There is no band I'd rather hear in the world than either of them.

Second, Furthur seems a little less free form to me.

Third, my favorite Dead songs have always been Jerry songs. Followed by covers. Followed by Phil songs (like Box of Rain or whatever else Phil is then singing). Followed by Bobby songs. That doesn't mean I'm a Bobby Hater. I'm not. But I like what I like.

Fourth, I just love Jackie Greene. I love his voice. I like his guitar and keyboard playing. I like his playfulness or whatever you want to call it. I love that guy.

Fifth, while not a Bobby Hater, I do find it annoying when Bobby forgets stuff or is hammered on stage (as he was at Best Buy a few years ago). Now sometimes the lines stuff is kind of amusing and charming. But I dunno, most times it isn't.

Sixth, Phil is the pulse and he seems to enjoy P&F more than Furthur. When Phil is happy, I'm happy.

Last, any show with JK and JG singing almost all of the songs, and them being Jerry songs in the main, is better than any other show.

Taking all that together, I guess it's pretty clear that I enjoy P&F a hell of a lot more than Furthur.

I've been seeing the Dead and all that came after them since 1979. First show was at the Cape Cod Colliseum though perhaps that show shouldn't count since I spent the whole night try to pick up this lassie who wouldn't bite. But my point is that I've been on this ride a long time, and when I say that I appreciate them both but like P&F more, I really mean it. This sound is so aweseome. I mean, Bobby is not my favorite element in the equation but I love the crap out of Rat Dog shows. So take it all in context, friends.
The following user(s) said Thank You: wharfrat71
dr bakes
Platinum Boarder
Posts:4218
Dizzy ain't the word for the way you're makin me

Re: Furthur -vs- Phil Lesh & Friends

#213579 1 year, 10 months ago
Phil &Friends is like a messy jelly sandwich, you know its going to spill all over the place. Furthur is a more structured jam sandwich.
Strangers stopping strangers just to shake their hand
The following user(s) said Thank You: wharfrat71
Time to create page: 0.30 seconds