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will work for doses
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Posts:539
I am Lobar speaking to you from the future

Re: Dead Hate

#100984 2 years, 10 months ago
Here's a little story for y'all. In the mid to late 80's I worked as a stage hand for Bill Graham. I was obviously very much a Dead Head, and man did it work against me being a new guy. 95% of the people I worked with couldn't stand them, and I was shunned. After proving that I could work just as hard as anyone else I was eventually welcomed into the fold.
I'd been working on shows for about 8 months, when during load out at the Greek in '87 the infamous Robbie Taylor asked one of the guys I worked with who I was, as in "hey, who's THAT guy?" like I was some dead head who climbed on the stage who wanted to get back stage or something. Fortunately the guy he asked said 'he's one of us'.
Another funny time was New Years '86 and I'd been out in the crowd, doing the boogie, and had to report back stage for load out. I looked like I'd been loading trucks all night with the sweat and all. I got some strange looks.
So haters are nothing new to me. If anything I pity them because they just never learned how much fun they've been missing.
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Chester
Moderator
Posts:33917
More or less in line

Re: Dead Hate

#100986 2 years, 10 months ago
I guess I could see that. Everybody, and every time is different. It's easy to look back, and not understand the feeling
at the time. But, just a thought, weren't there a lot of Pigpen fans who left when they brought Keith in?
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ZenoMarx
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Re: Dead Hate

#101001 2 years, 10 months ago
doin_that_rag wrote:
i can't imagine being a deadhead and then jumping off the bus right before it spiraled into something really, really amazing
It was already something extraordinary and hitting all the senses at an astounding level of artistry from so many angles. song, improvisation, sound, light, technological advancement, community, and the list might go on and on.

Incredibly volatile time in our history and the history of the world. It was more than music, which I think we all acknowledge. Having something so tightly knit and safe and feeling of "ours" spreading into unknown territory, possibly facing the erosion of its virtues could reasonably be shocking enough to want to both protect it and to want to distance yourself from it. I can empathize with the various arguments and feelings. I won't pretend I'd know how I'd feel at that moment in time.
You aren't interesting or clever when you write or speak in the lyrics of others. Rather, what are YOUR words?
Equinox
Platinum Boarder
Posts:17127

Re: Dead Hate

#101065 2 years, 10 months ago
Chester wrote:
But, just a thought, weren't there a lot of Pigpen fans who left when they brought Keith in?


Yes.
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JAugustW
Junior Boarder
Posts:81

Re: Dead Hate

#101068 2 years, 10 months ago
doin_that_rag wrote:
JAugustW your input is greatly appreciated seeing as most people here saw their shows in the 80's or are like me and were born after the fact (i was 4 when Jerry died), not to take anything away from all the other wonderful people who post here but i am fascinated by the fact that you said you first caught them in the late 60's/early 70's (or maybe i'm dreaming but i think i remember you saying that), but i have to ask people were actually upset with Workingman's Dead and American Beauty..it's not that i don't believe you, but those are my two favorite albums of all time and i can't wrap my head around anyone not liking them...that's crazy i can't imagine being a deadhead and then jumping off the bus right before it spiraled into something really, really amazing i bet they are kicking themselves now (or jumped back on and never admit that they weren't too fond of the new direction the dead went at the turn of the 70's)

if i may ask, do you have a favorite show from the earlier days JAugustW, i love the early stuff the best and would love to hear some stories from someone who was there early on


First of all, I agree with you about Workingman's Dead and American Beauty. Absolutely. Beyond that, I contend that they represent the two best back-to-back albums ever by anyone.
And, yes, I ran into any number of people who didn't like either then. Not "edgy" enough for them. Or "psychedelic." Or some fucking thing.
Unlike the way I am now -- a virtual recluse -- I interacted with a lot of people back then. Lived in a big house in North Oakland with about six others... always lots of people crashing (most of whom none of us even knew)... a party every day... so I always got lots of feedback and opinions. Probably heard it all, in fact.
My favorite show in those days? Well, I remember my first (Winterland; NRPS with Jerry opening... late '69? early '70?) as if it was yesterday. I have no recollection of ever being disappointed at any of my many subsequent Winterland shows, either... of which, I probably saw at least a third of all of them (the only reason I missed any was because I went back east a few times for long visits).
I do remember being at one of the most infamous Winterland shows ever, though. It made the SF Chronicle the next day. Somehow, a lot of people in attendance ended up getting dosed when they didn't want to be. Either that, or got dosed with something a lot more potent than what they were accustomed to. Anyway, I'm not bragging about that... just happened to be there.
I wish I could be more specific about those shows, but it was a long time ago, and they really do tend to blur into one another. Winterland was good times, though... the best. And I'm happy in the extreme that I got to be there.
But the '60s in general? The early days? Yeah, the music was something magical, but the rest of it, you can have. Too much madness unfolding. For me, anyway. That fucking war not only ruined or ended too many fucking lives, it turned too many of us against one another. Which I do remember. All too fucking well. And our country ain't over it yet.
P.S. just added... One of my best, best, best Winterland shows ever? Allman Brothers. I forget the year, but was it sweet!
Last Edit: 2 years, 10 months ago by JAugustW. Reason: Added something
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BillyDeLion
Junior Boarder
Posts:294

Re: Dead Hate

#101100 2 years, 10 months ago
doin_that_rag wrote:
JAugustW your input is greatly appreciated seeing as most people here saw their shows in the 80's or are like me and were born after the fact (i was 4 when Jerry died), not to take anything away from all the other wonderful people who post here but i am fascinated by the fact that you said you first caught them in the late 60's/early 70's (or maybe i'm dreaming but i think i remember you saying that), but i have to ask people were actually upset with Workingman's Dead and American Beauty..it's not that i don't believe you, but those are my two favorite albums of all time and i can't wrap my head around anyone not liking them...that's crazy i can't imagine being a deadhead and then jumping off the bus right before it spiraled into something really, really amazing i bet they are kicking themselves now (or jumped back on and never admit that they weren't too fond of the new direction the dead went at the turn of the 70's)

if i may ask, do you have a favorite show from the earlier days JAugustW, i love the early stuff the best and would love to hear some stories from someone who was there early on


I got on the bus in the late 70's. I have a friend who I met many years later who told me how he and his wife stopped going to shows after Pigpen died. The stories he told me from the early days are fascinating. Getting tickets for the Fillmore East back in 70 and 71 were more difficult than we might think!

When I was starting to listen to the GD in the late 70's there was a lot of put downs and hate from the rock crowd. Reviews of Dead shows completely missed the point and often go on and on about the audience and not the music. The Shakedown Street album was panned as the Dead sell out and "they went disco!". In short, it wasn't cool to be a Deadhead.
These are the good old days!!
Bakes
Platinum Boarder
Posts:1428
Wildflower seed on the sand and stone....

Re: Dead Hate

#101115 2 years, 10 months ago
I saw my first show in 1984. I really dug Brent with the band. After Brent died I really liked Hornsby a lot, but sort became critical of Vince's sound. It always happens when there is change, but I never stopped enjoying the music and went stomping off like some didt
Bilbo
Senior Boarder
Posts:586
They Love eachother...

Re: Dead Hate

#101148 2 years, 10 months ago
Good point Phrend. Seems like times change and poeple change. When I first heard Workingmans, thought it to be some

country shit. Now, it's like way up there as a favorite. When poeple learn to roll with the waves and not get hung up on

petty crap, we all get along much better. What was it that Jerry says on the YT clip?...."why can't we all just get along?"

Good one Jer!
Peals of fragile thunder...keeping time...
scar1et_f1re
Platinum Boarder
Posts:4900
R U Kind?

Re: Dead Hate

#101154 2 years, 10 months ago
JAugustW wrote:
doin_that_rag wrote:
JAugustW your input is greatly appreciated seeing as most people here saw their shows in the 80's or are like me and were born after the fact (i was 4 when Jerry died), not to take anything away from all the other wonderful people who post here but i am fascinated by the fact that you said you first caught them in the late 60's/early 70's (or maybe i'm dreaming but i think i remember you saying that), but i have to ask people were actually upset with Workingman's Dead and American Beauty..it's not that i don't believe you, but those are my two favorite albums of all time and i can't wrap my head around anyone not liking them...that's crazy i can't imagine being a deadhead and then jumping off the bus right before it spiraled into something really, really amazing i bet they are kicking themselves now (or jumped back on and never admit that they weren't too fond of the new direction the dead went at the turn of the 70's)

if i may ask, do you have a favorite show from the earlier days JAugustW, i love the early stuff the best and would love to hear some stories from someone who was there early on


First of all, I agree with you about Workingman's Dead and American Beauty. Absolutely. Beyond that, I contend that they represent the two best back-to-back albums ever by anyone.
And, yes, I ran into any number of people who didn't like either then. Not "edgy" enough for them. Or "psychedelic." Or some fucking thing.
Unlike the way I am now -- a virtual recluse -- I interacted with a lot of people back then. Lived in a big house in North Oakland with about six others... always lots of people crashing (most of whom none of us even knew)... a party every day... so I always got lots of feedback and opinions. Probably heard it all, in fact.
My favorite show in those days? Well, I remember my first (Winterland; NRPS with Jerry opening... late '69? early '70?) as if it was yesterday. I have no recollection of ever being disappointed at any of my many subsequent Winterland shows, either... of which, I probably saw at least a third of all of them (the only reason I missed any was because I went back east a few times for long visits).
I do remember being at one of the most infamous Winterland shows ever, though. It made the SF Chronicle the next day. Somehow, a lot of people in attendance ended up getting dosed when they didn't want to be. Either that, or got dosed with something a lot more potent than what they were accustomed to. Anyway, I'm not bragging about that... just happened to be there.
I wish I could be more specific about those shows, but it was a long time ago, and they really do tend to blur into one another. Winterland was good times, though... the best. And I'm happy in the extreme that I got to be there.
But the '60s in general? The early days? Yeah, the music was something magical, but the rest of it, you can have. Too much madness unfolding. For me, anyway. That fucking war not only ruined or ended too many fucking lives, it turned too many of us against one another. Which I do remember. All too fucking well. And our country ain't over it yet.
P.S. just added... One of my best, best, best Winterland shows ever? Allman Brothers. I forget the year, but was it sweet!


My understanding is there were so many good groups playing back then that it was more common to frequent the venues run by Bobo and others as opposed to later on when people used to follow a particular band or group of bands wherever they played. Did you find that to be the case back then JAugustWest?
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And let others do for you
lostsailor
Senior Boarder
Posts:552

Re: Dead Hate

#101207 2 years, 10 months ago
Bili wrote:
when i toured with the dead bobby was cheesy....


Don't ever for a minute think that it's easy being cheesy. Because it ain't easy.
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